Here is Carp’s review of last night’s game. Enjoy!
99 responses to “Rangers-3, Lightning-7”
SN
is it over yet?
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In 10th slot, possible move up to 7th.
Beezle
The breakdowns were disappointing. Wicky needs to teach these guys how to pass to their own team when trying to leave the zone
Bdl
Very strange night. Glad Hank won. He was the most, and probably only deserving player.
Beezle
Drury had 2 goals ..er RBIs last night
Pete
Guessing they didn’t start hank at home so he wouldn’t get embarrassed by the lightning! Now they’ll start him tnte against the medicore Candy Canes and he will likely get a win and hurt our draft position even more.
—/
For a GM who claims to want to rebuild the team, Gorton has done a pretty bad job overseeing personnel decisions since the deadline (starting I’d argue by taking on spooner and Names) and it’s in all likelihood going to cost them at the draft. This franchise just can’t do much right!!
St Pete Eli
Agree Pete, Gorton needs to get it right at the draft and make the right moves over the summer or games like last night will be the norm (No pun intended) for many years to come ugh! They really look like a team that knew they were going to lose.
ilb2001
This franchise can do nothing right. Nothing. How they went on this commendable, exciting, deep, and entertaining 12 year run when they never played as much as a single game being out of the playoffs picture until this year will remain the biggest mystery in hockey.
Guys were screaming for a rebuild. Well this is what a rebuild looks like. Still want it?
Pete
Ilb, I wasn’t writing off all of their past accomplishments and I’m sure you were being somewhat facetious. However, hope you and Carp can forgive me if I don’t cherish all of this last run. I for sure enjoyed the team Torts built (and it truly was a team) and was fully caught up in the Cup run (altho still disappointed by the disappearing act done by far too many of their “stars” in the finals). But Slats just couldn’t help himself and instead immediately started to dismantle that 14 team and went back to his wholly unsuccessful ways of signing washed up former stars, overpaying at the deadline for B+ talent and also let promising players walk (Stralman) and was unable to walk away from players who served us well but were no longer what they were (ie staal). AV doing his best renney impression in overplaying on some of those same players (staal and Girardi) sure didn’t help things. So semi-final run in 14-15 notwithstanding, don’t think they’ve done much right since then in my opinion.
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And I commend Gorton for facing up to the fact that guys needed to be moved (tho could have said the same thing last season or the one before it), but thus far i have not been overwhelmed by the pieces he has obtained . He needs either some extreme luck in the lottery or to pull some magic at the draft (and maybe both) to really change the direction of this franchise. Just my opinion of course and would be thrilled if I was dead wrong
Pete
BDL, they are still trying to have it both ways, ie being competitive while they rebuild, which will may ultimately get them back to the playoffs quickly, but wouldn’t expect a Cup anytime soon if they follow that path. Gorton’s offseason activities will be very telling on how committed he (and dolan and Slats) is to a real rebuild
Old Ranger Fan
Do any of the cookies have NMCs?
Bdl
Pete,
You haven’t seen the guys they received in the trades. How can you be underwhelmed? We most certainly don’t know who there going to draft with the picks they got. Gorton did the first part of the job, now the hard part starts. Deciding on AV, the draft, and hopefully Zucc.
SN
Pete – you must tow the company line! All is well! All is well!!!
SN
Toe
ilb2001
Somewhat facetious?
Old Ranger Fan
Got to be more to the story. JT for Namestoolong is not an even up trade. JT is a No. 1 pick who has put up decent numbers for several years now. If they move NTL at the draft they’ll get a mid round pick for him. If there is no back story then they just can’t evaluate talent and that is a scary proposition. Why was there such urgency to move him?
Bobbyo
Nice write up by Carp…Gorton made Right moves and team will look alot different next year…no reason they can’t compete for a playoff spot
SN
ORF – the zealots will say he was a bad egg and lockeroom cancer; no room for those not playing the AV way. Soft and compliant are the main attributes.
Horrible asset management; could have traded him for DEFENSE help instead of another soft middle 6 forward who can’t generate offense.
Bdl
The Miller trade is a flat out bad trade. The befuddling thing about is, does it mean AV stays, and if he doesn’t stay, wouldn’t you have wanted to see Miller with a different coach before you give up on him? Strange move.
Pete
Bdl, you are right and I’m going mostly by projections/analysis of the trades and picks so far (absent limited times I’ve seen the guys in the nhl and wjc this year). However, going by those sources i am not overly optimistic (hajek could surprise and be top pair and Chytil could do the same, but Lias and especially howden have been described as more likely good 3rd line centers and some have even said 4th line center for Howden). And hate to be a joykill, but if they just end up drafting 10th and two picks at the back of the draft I wouldn’t count on any of those guys being stars and likely not even NHLers for a few years (if ever)
Bdl
I’m not writing off Namestnkov, I think he’s a serviceable player just having a hard time adjusting.
Bdl
From what I have read, Howden the s the type of center the Rangers have not had in there system since Brandon Dubinsky. Very different from the type of centers they currently have. So 3rd line, 4th line, I don’t care. They need what he supposedly brings.
Bdl
As far as Hajek goes, I have been reading nothing but positive things about him. Don’t forget Lindgren. He’s also a guy who plays a different game on D than what the Rangers currently have.
Old Ranger Fan
I can see the McD trade. His dynamic skating was what set him apart and he doesn’t seem to be able to do that anymore. Someone will overpay for him next summer. But why was Miller essentially a throw in? Maybe they could have packaged him with one of the No.1s they have to move up in the draft. Unless he is still in shock from the trade and it is effecting his play, I see NTL going to arbitration and them walking away from the award since it will be built on Tampa numbers he won’t duplicate for them. Did Miller do something to piss off Slats? This is like sending McLean to the Manitoba Moose. It came out of nowhere.
Bdl
O’Gara, Sproul, and Gilmour will be in the AHL next year. Without trades and buyouts, you have Staal, Shatennkirk, Skjei, and Pionk coming back on D. There will be spots open.
Pete
Bdl, sorry but i find it underwhelming that they traded their best player (who is on team friendly deal next year as well) and one of their better young forwards and they couldn’t also get a forward prospect who at least projects as a scorer in the NHL. Howden is the kind of center they could have drafted at the end of the first round this year. Names need to show a lot next year to show he is worth keeping and good chance we will move him before his arbitration anyways and we won’t be getting back someone as good as Miller or a 1st or even likely a 2nd round pick
ilb2001
BDL- Namestnikov looked pretty good when he started here, but his played dipped substantially as of late. I sometimes wonder whether he wants to stay here.
Miller’s main issue is his Dubinsky/Callahan type of a contract that he will command soon. Gorton knee that and wasn’t willing to give it him.
James G
Didn’t realize that Miller’s production since the trade picked up to the point that we will see him set a career high in points for the third year in a row. Pretty good for a throw in who dogs it, eh?
James G
The fact that there’s a cookie in Brooklyn with a Ryan Sproul Jersey decorated onto the front just about sums up this season.
This IS what a rebuild looks like. Be glad they’re doing it now and not waiting for another “dark age” to occur
James G
ILB came out swinging this morning. I love it.
Bdl
Pete,
No argument about trading Miller. Sold low. Should have waited to see what he looked like with a new coach.
I was a big McD fan, but I think they sold him at the right time. His play was trending down.
Bdl
James,
You are forgetting the only reason Millers production is up is because of who he is playing with. He deserves no credit for it.
Pete
Sold a the right time but wish they just targeted skill (especially offensive) first and foremost. Liked Dubi, but need a lot more than those type of players to win cups and it’s not that hard to find those kind of guys in the draft. Heck we just took one with our 7th overall pick last year!!
Pete
and James, rebuilding teams should be picking in the top 5 for a couple years. TBD if we even do so once
Bdl
Pete,
I liked Taylor Raddysh, but he has some warts on his scouting report too. Not considered the greatest of skaters.
Pete
We have no scoring in the system (or really the NHL) so give me all the scorers, warts and all, at this point!
Posted this at Carp’s game recap and I wanted to post here as well because I feel that strongly about it.
I feel like I have watched Conor McDonald grow up through the years that the Steven McDonald Award is given out. When I had season tickets back in the day, the two games that I never would sell were Opening Night and the night the Extra Effort Award was given out. It always bring a tear to my eyes and a smile to my heart because it is the one thing the Rangers organization has gotten right the last 30 years.
Old Ranger Fan
I’d rather have them lose 2-1 and 3-2 next year than win some games 5 to 4. Have to re-establish team D to build a contender. The team now is starting to look like the team that Sather blew up before the lockout that established the cap.
James G
BDL touché. But I’m my defense I’ve only made that argument as it pertains to comparing him to Namestnikov.
James G
Pete the scoring is very much a concern
SN
Heetle can skate, that’s for sure. Impressing every game.
St Pete Eli
I enjoyed every minute of their run many great and lasting memories. And I am by no means going to be a constant whiner during the rebuild I was on board before it happened. But looking at the Miller trade all I am saying is that the Rangers more often than not seem to wind up on the wrong end of draft picks and trades. Doesn’t matter why Miller was moved the Rangers got the short end of the stick. This bad management decision making needs to stop for this organization top make it to the top!
how can it even be suggested they’re not committed to this rebuild?
SN
Carp – question is for how long? How are they defining a ‘rebuild’; next level up from rebuilding on the fly?
Bdl
I believe that they are committed to a rebuild. The question is, is it a bottom out rebuild, or a one year and regroup rebuild?
Bobbyo
Offense is fine …defense needs to be addressed and sure Gorton knows it
Bobbyo
And why can’t Rangers make playoffs next year?
SN
Is the goal to make the playoffs as the 14 or 16 best team next season or rebuild the roster for another extenddd run as a top 4 or 6 team??
Alex
Pete
they had to tale Spooner and Beleskey and their contracts (well 50 percent of the latter) to allow Nash to go to Boston.
Pete
Carp, they have not put themselves in the best position to get the highest possible draft pick this year is my biggest gripe (besides the Miller return). It might not have been pretty, but they should have dressed less competitive line ups post deadline. They didn’t do so and now likely will pick 10th instead of 4th
Bobbyo
SN extended runs like Isles Oilers or Arizona? Rather go Boston route than wait and hope for ping pong balls
Alex
They traded some of my favs and it hurts. I understand the deals but still hurts.
The part I don’t understand is the Miller/Names part of the Tampa deal. I truly believe that the deal could have been made without those 2.
I want no part of Nash even at half his old deal. His number of concussions is a big concern.
I’d rather say no to Grabner too. We will not be good next year with or without so rather his Ranger tenure be the 2 very solid years he gave us. I valued him a lot more than his goals. He gave us what we missed when we gave Hags away.
Pete
Boston didn’t trade away their firsts for multiple years and they didn’t go off board all that often in the 1st round! Boston also got a very high first round pick (or picks I forget) by trading kessel (himself a 5th overall pick in 06). So even the Boston route will take a few years and some high picks
Bdl
Not trading Zucc in the purge was a mistake. Guessing they kept him for the fans, but they would have been much better off just ripping the bandage off.
they tried to trade him, had last-minute offers while they were tying up the complicated McDonagh deal. They can still trade him, since he wasn’t a rental, at the draft or over the summer. Or if they don’t like the return they keep him. They are going to need some NHL players.
there’s no way they were going to absolutely tank. to their credit. this is better for the development of the kids they have.
Pete
in the last 15 years, the Bruins traded their 1st pick in 04, 13 and this year. Otherwise they always drafted in the 1st round and on more than one occasion had multiple 1st round picks. We need to have multiple 1st rounders another couple years and ideally draft top 5 more than once. Drafting 10th and say 27 and 30th this year and then making the playoffs next year and drafting say 20th ain’t gonna cut it
Bdl
They need to move on from Zucc. I have seen enough of his selfish play over the last two seasons. I don’t really care what they get for him. It will be addition by subtraction.
Bobbyo
Zucc is a top 6 you need to get good return
Bdl
If they get good return, great, but regardless of the return he needs to go.
I also don’t think you trade Topo for good riddance. They are sorely lacking in top-six wingers. if the return isn’t good, you keep him. If the return is good, bye.
Norm Merton
ilb and Carp, thanks as always for your rational commentary when all around you is ledge. As to last night, I’m fairly certain the Bolts have a better roster than the Rangers and was not surprised that they eventually took over and ran away. Spooner’s and Pavelec’s (and, yes, the refs’) tough nights didn’t help, but the outcome was hardly surprising. At least they didn’t lose the 1st period!
Alex
if not traded this summer, they can still get a nice return for zucc at next trade deadline.
Norm Merton
The lottery position is firming up. The Rangers can realistically finish only between 7th and 10th, giving them from a 20.4% to 11.4% chance at a top-three and between 6.5% and 3.5% to get Dahlin. Most likely they’ll be picking from 7 to 10, unless they think anyone but Dahlin is worth moving up for.
Bdl
What is good return on Zucc? I might be biased, but I also think I’m realistic. I think the high on Zucc is what they got for Grabner. What we should expect is a middling prospect and a mid round pick. They are not getting a Nash package for him.
James G
Trade the cookies. Eat their contracts
Pete
Carp up until two games ago there were very few new “kids” playing that are likely to be part of the longterm plan. I’d say really just Pionk if we are being honest (again not talking about Lias or Chytil), so don’t think it was a big concern if he lost more than he won his first 15 or so games. Up until what 3 games ago we were still playing a 4th line of all journeymen vets, so were we worried about their feelings too?!
John M Perez
Still smh over the Rangers losing JT Miller. lol- didn’t want to pay him for a big contract?? That’s sound logic; draft him first, invest the time of your hockey program to develop the player; & then unload him at the ripe old age of 25. Good chance he’ll be in the league for the next 10 years; putting up good numbers; plus he has big game pedigree in his arsenal; look for him to score big time goals in the playoffs. Stevie Y’s nobody’s fool.
Pete
Except he was a fool giving Cally that contract and he hasn’t been able to assemble a solid group of defenseman until this trade deadline and still not an ideal group
So I have no medical background, but, have observed that players that have generalized back problems sometimes have prematurely shortened careers. Adam Graves, Kevin Klein and maybe now McD come to mind. Can lingering effects cause them to skate more erect and take away some of their explosiveness and mobility? Certainly hand eye coordination doesn’t drop off at 30. Does anyone with some knowledge have an opinion?
Bdl
Miller is do to score in the playoffs. 1 goal in 40 games.
SN
BRuins had 2 first line forwards and a mid round 1st playing top pair 18 months after his draft.
Norm Merton
Procrastinating, just ran an average of 8 polls (Hockey Writers, ISS, NHL…) to see what the scouting consensus was on the upcoming draft, and here are the averages for the top ten (Rangers now in the 10 hole):
Pretty clear top 4. Significant dropoff from Hughes to Dobson and even more to the 11 spot, Hayten. I’m sure the list will change by June, but for now not that much worth tanking for. Maybe you trade to get the #4; otherwise it’s what your scouts think of the rest of them.
I find it difficult to believe that JT Miller has yet to do anything dumb so far in Tampa. Perhaps he has just been put in a position to succeed. The Rangers do not have anyone as good as the 2 linemates he is playing with, so there’s that. Still, it does not appear likely that Namestnikov will stick around and it once again looks like the Rangers were fleeced by Yzerman. There is also the play of McDonagh……..which has not been anywhere near his former excellence in the 5 or so Tampa games I have seen since he went there. Carp called the McDonagh deal a year ago so even then, the Rangers were concerned about the value of a big investment in him. Girardi seems to be productive in Tampa which could be systems related, or simply that the Tampa forwards play much closer to 200 feet than the Rangers forwards do.
Bobbyo
Not sold on Tampa,,,,if they do not hold that division lead they may be out after first round
Bdl
Speaking of McDonagh and Girardi. Hedman and Strallman matched up against the Rangers number one line (Zibanijad line). McDonagh and Girardi got the 2nd and 3rd line assignment.
Alex
Rangers had the last change BDL
not Tampa
Pete
So you only listed 9 players Norm, but don’t see how you come to the conclusion that we wouldn’t be better off drafting top 6. The two wingers after Dahlin are good goal scorers and are said to be NHL ready or close. And wahlstrom and tkachuk could be pretty good players in a couple seasons two (I’d lean towards wahlstrom as Tkachuk has yet to put up goals really the last couple levels he has been in). All that is to say we’d be much better off drafting higher
Bdl
I’m well aware Alex.
Norm Merton
Oops! Thanks for noting that, Pete. It’s Hayton at 10 (avg. 12.0 in polls) and then Lundestrom in 11th (at 12.8). And of course the Rangers would be better in the top 6, but they can’t get there without trading. They were never going to be able to tank to the 4-hole, much less the top3, in the wildest dreams of fans who would have preferred they try to lose. Realistically, they’re now looking at any one of: Bouchard/Hughes/Dobson/Hayton, if their scouts happen to be in line with the writers.
just saw Torts inspecting the giant metal walls installed in hallway between locker rooms at Rogers Arena. He seemed at a loss to understand why they’d be needed
Credit to the Bruins–they were a pretty meh-looking crew early on and now look like legit contenders. Nice job by mgmt. Dammit.
Norm Merton
Good thing, Carp, that when you don’t know what to say, you do know how to write.
Bdl
That is a Fraudulent Fondue Fork!
Bdl
If you are rooting for Tampa to win the cup ( I’m not), this would be the year to root for them. The wheels are going to fall off next year, and that would make next years pick a good one.
Alex
BDL
i don’t think the wheels fall off for Tampa. They’re well positioned in my view. They can also buyout Coburn or Cally or both.
And for the record I wish them much success and it will improve a 2nd rd pick for us to a 1st.
Alex
My preferred cup teams are
Tampa
Toronto
Winnipeg
Dan Tetrault
Hanks jock strap should always get the extra effort award. Apparently that thing does all the heavy lifting every game! 😉
Pete
Eh they were right on pace for around 4-5th before the trip to westerner Canada where they won three straight games. But 7th is best we could do now, tho not even hopeful for that
jpp
I agree with John m perez. How you trade someone you drafted @ 15 who has scored 50+ points in each of the last 3 seasons, who is a strong skilled physical player, who is also 24 years old.
Telling me the rangers we’re in no rush to trade zucc but JT had to go at the deadline bc of a long term contract extension they could have put off for a year with arbitration. It’s not like they got much value for him now,I would like to think Gorton could landed the picks and prospects for mcdonagh alone. Which makes it miller for Namestnikov. I don’t understand it unless J.T. made a big public stink about the sell off and JG saw it as cancerous going forward. Still jumped the shark on that one. Should have been a draft summer trade. Bad move
Rather than building expensive giant metal walls all over the NHL in order to keep Torts on his own side and then trying to make Musky pay for them, cheaper to hire McGrattan to shadow Torts around the Nation.
99 responses to “Rangers-3, Lightning-7”
is it over yet?
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In 10th slot, possible move up to 7th.
The breakdowns were disappointing. Wicky needs to teach these guys how to pass to their own team when trying to leave the zone
Very strange night. Glad Hank won. He was the most, and probably only deserving player.
Drury had 2 goals ..er RBIs last night
Guessing they didn’t start hank at home so he wouldn’t get embarrassed by the lightning! Now they’ll start him tnte against the medicore Candy Canes and he will likely get a win and hurt our draft position even more.
—/
For a GM who claims to want to rebuild the team, Gorton has done a pretty bad job overseeing personnel decisions since the deadline (starting I’d argue by taking on spooner and Names) and it’s in all likelihood going to cost them at the draft. This franchise just can’t do much right!!
Agree Pete, Gorton needs to get it right at the draft and make the right moves over the summer or games like last night will be the norm (No pun intended) for many years to come ugh! They really look like a team that knew they were going to lose.
This franchise can do nothing right. Nothing. How they went on this commendable, exciting, deep, and entertaining 12 year run when they never played as much as a single game being out of the playoffs picture until this year will remain the biggest mystery in hockey.
Happy last home game of the season.
Handmade in Brooklyn.
Happy Passover!
Wow talk about commitment… a Sproul cookie?
Guys were screaming for a rebuild. Well this is what a rebuild looks like. Still want it?
Ilb, I wasn’t writing off all of their past accomplishments and I’m sure you were being somewhat facetious. However, hope you and Carp can forgive me if I don’t cherish all of this last run. I for sure enjoyed the team Torts built (and it truly was a team) and was fully caught up in the Cup run (altho still disappointed by the disappearing act done by far too many of their “stars” in the finals). But Slats just couldn’t help himself and instead immediately started to dismantle that 14 team and went back to his wholly unsuccessful ways of signing washed up former stars, overpaying at the deadline for B+ talent and also let promising players walk (Stralman) and was unable to walk away from players who served us well but were no longer what they were (ie staal). AV doing his best renney impression in overplaying on some of those same players (staal and Girardi) sure didn’t help things. So semi-final run in 14-15 notwithstanding, don’t think they’ve done much right since then in my opinion.
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And I commend Gorton for facing up to the fact that guys needed to be moved (tho could have said the same thing last season or the one before it), but thus far i have not been overwhelmed by the pieces he has obtained . He needs either some extreme luck in the lottery or to pull some magic at the draft (and maybe both) to really change the direction of this franchise. Just my opinion of course and would be thrilled if I was dead wrong
BDL, they are still trying to have it both ways, ie being competitive while they rebuild, which will may ultimately get them back to the playoffs quickly, but wouldn’t expect a Cup anytime soon if they follow that path. Gorton’s offseason activities will be very telling on how committed he (and dolan and Slats) is to a real rebuild
Do any of the cookies have NMCs?
Pete,
You haven’t seen the guys they received in the trades. How can you be underwhelmed? We most certainly don’t know who there going to draft with the picks they got. Gorton did the first part of the job, now the hard part starts. Deciding on AV, the draft, and hopefully Zucc.
Pete – you must tow the company line! All is well! All is well!!!
Toe
Somewhat facetious?
Got to be more to the story. JT for Namestoolong is not an even up trade. JT is a No. 1 pick who has put up decent numbers for several years now. If they move NTL at the draft they’ll get a mid round pick for him. If there is no back story then they just can’t evaluate talent and that is a scary proposition. Why was there such urgency to move him?
Nice write up by Carp…Gorton made Right moves and team will look alot different next year…no reason they can’t compete for a playoff spot
ORF – the zealots will say he was a bad egg and lockeroom cancer; no room for those not playing the AV way. Soft and compliant are the main attributes.
Horrible asset management; could have traded him for DEFENSE help instead of another soft middle 6 forward who can’t generate offense.
The Miller trade is a flat out bad trade. The befuddling thing about is, does it mean AV stays, and if he doesn’t stay, wouldn’t you have wanted to see Miller with a different coach before you give up on him? Strange move.
Bdl, you are right and I’m going mostly by projections/analysis of the trades and picks so far (absent limited times I’ve seen the guys in the nhl and wjc this year). However, going by those sources i am not overly optimistic (hajek could surprise and be top pair and Chytil could do the same, but Lias and especially howden have been described as more likely good 3rd line centers and some have even said 4th line center for Howden). And hate to be a joykill, but if they just end up drafting 10th and two picks at the back of the draft I wouldn’t count on any of those guys being stars and likely not even NHLers for a few years (if ever)
I’m not writing off Namestnkov, I think he’s a serviceable player just having a hard time adjusting.
From what I have read, Howden the s the type of center the Rangers have not had in there system since Brandon Dubinsky. Very different from the type of centers they currently have. So 3rd line, 4th line, I don’t care. They need what he supposedly brings.
As far as Hajek goes, I have been reading nothing but positive things about him. Don’t forget Lindgren. He’s also a guy who plays a different game on D than what the Rangers currently have.
I can see the McD trade. His dynamic skating was what set him apart and he doesn’t seem to be able to do that anymore. Someone will overpay for him next summer. But why was Miller essentially a throw in? Maybe they could have packaged him with one of the No.1s they have to move up in the draft. Unless he is still in shock from the trade and it is effecting his play, I see NTL going to arbitration and them walking away from the award since it will be built on Tampa numbers he won’t duplicate for them. Did Miller do something to piss off Slats? This is like sending McLean to the Manitoba Moose. It came out of nowhere.
O’Gara, Sproul, and Gilmour will be in the AHL next year. Without trades and buyouts, you have Staal, Shatennkirk, Skjei, and Pionk coming back on D. There will be spots open.
Bdl, sorry but i find it underwhelming that they traded their best player (who is on team friendly deal next year as well) and one of their better young forwards and they couldn’t also get a forward prospect who at least projects as a scorer in the NHL. Howden is the kind of center they could have drafted at the end of the first round this year. Names need to show a lot next year to show he is worth keeping and good chance we will move him before his arbitration anyways and we won’t be getting back someone as good as Miller or a 1st or even likely a 2nd round pick
BDL- Namestnikov looked pretty good when he started here, but his played dipped substantially as of late. I sometimes wonder whether he wants to stay here.
Miller’s main issue is his Dubinsky/Callahan type of a contract that he will command soon. Gorton knee that and wasn’t willing to give it him.
Didn’t realize that Miller’s production since the trade picked up to the point that we will see him set a career high in points for the third year in a row. Pretty good for a throw in who dogs it, eh?
The fact that there’s a cookie in Brooklyn with a Ryan Sproul Jersey decorated onto the front just about sums up this season.
This IS what a rebuild looks like. Be glad they’re doing it now and not waiting for another “dark age” to occur
ILB came out swinging this morning. I love it.
Pete,
No argument about trading Miller. Sold low. Should have waited to see what he looked like with a new coach.
I was a big McD fan, but I think they sold him at the right time. His play was trending down.
James,
You are forgetting the only reason Millers production is up is because of who he is playing with. He deserves no credit for it.
Sold a the right time but wish they just targeted skill (especially offensive) first and foremost. Liked Dubi, but need a lot more than those type of players to win cups and it’s not that hard to find those kind of guys in the draft. Heck we just took one with our 7th overall pick last year!!
and James, rebuilding teams should be picking in the top 5 for a couple years. TBD if we even do so once
Pete,
I liked Taylor Raddysh, but he has some warts on his scouting report too. Not considered the greatest of skaters.
We have no scoring in the system (or really the NHL) so give me all the scorers, warts and all, at this point!
Posted this at Carp’s game recap and I wanted to post here as well because I feel that strongly about it.
I feel like I have watched Conor McDonald grow up through the years that the Steven McDonald Award is given out. When I had season tickets back in the day, the two games that I never would sell were Opening Night and the night the Extra Effort Award was given out. It always bring a tear to my eyes and a smile to my heart because it is the one thing the Rangers organization has gotten right the last 30 years.
I’d rather have them lose 2-1 and 3-2 next year than win some games 5 to 4. Have to re-establish team D to build a contender. The team now is starting to look like the team that Sather blew up before the lockout that established the cap.
BDL touché. But I’m my defense I’ve only made that argument as it pertains to comparing him to Namestnikov.
Pete the scoring is very much a concern
Heetle can skate, that’s for sure. Impressing every game.
I enjoyed every minute of their run many great and lasting memories. And I am by no means going to be a constant whiner during the rebuild I was on board before it happened. But looking at the Miller trade all I am saying is that the Rangers more often than not seem to wind up on the wrong end of draft picks and trades. Doesn’t matter why Miller was moved the Rangers got the short end of the stick. This bad management decision making needs to stop for this organization top make it to the top!
how can it even be suggested they’re not committed to this rebuild?
Carp – question is for how long? How are they defining a ‘rebuild’; next level up from rebuilding on the fly?
I believe that they are committed to a rebuild. The question is, is it a bottom out rebuild, or a one year and regroup rebuild?
Offense is fine …defense needs to be addressed and sure Gorton knows it
And why can’t Rangers make playoffs next year?
Is the goal to make the playoffs as the 14 or 16 best team next season or rebuild the roster for another extenddd run as a top 4 or 6 team??
Pete
they had to tale Spooner and Beleskey and their contracts (well 50 percent of the latter) to allow Nash to go to Boston.
Carp, they have not put themselves in the best position to get the highest possible draft pick this year is my biggest gripe (besides the Miller return). It might not have been pretty, but they should have dressed less competitive line ups post deadline. They didn’t do so and now likely will pick 10th instead of 4th
SN extended runs like Isles Oilers or Arizona? Rather go Boston route than wait and hope for ping pong balls
They traded some of my favs and it hurts. I understand the deals but still hurts.
The part I don’t understand is the Miller/Names part of the Tampa deal. I truly believe that the deal could have been made without those 2.
I want no part of Nash even at half his old deal. His number of concussions is a big concern.
I’d rather say no to Grabner too. We will not be good next year with or without so rather his Ranger tenure be the 2 very solid years he gave us. I valued him a lot more than his goals. He gave us what we missed when we gave Hags away.
Boston didn’t trade away their firsts for multiple years and they didn’t go off board all that often in the 1st round! Boston also got a very high first round pick (or picks I forget) by trading kessel (himself a 5th overall pick in 06). So even the Boston route will take a few years and some high picks
Not trading Zucc in the purge was a mistake. Guessing they kept him for the fans, but they would have been much better off just ripping the bandage off.
they tried to trade him, had last-minute offers while they were tying up the complicated McDonagh deal. They can still trade him, since he wasn’t a rental, at the draft or over the summer. Or if they don’t like the return they keep him. They are going to need some NHL players.
there’s no way they were going to absolutely tank. to their credit. this is better for the development of the kids they have.
in the last 15 years, the Bruins traded their 1st pick in 04, 13 and this year. Otherwise they always drafted in the 1st round and on more than one occasion had multiple 1st round picks. We need to have multiple 1st rounders another couple years and ideally draft top 5 more than once. Drafting 10th and say 27 and 30th this year and then making the playoffs next year and drafting say 20th ain’t gonna cut it
They need to move on from Zucc. I have seen enough of his selfish play over the last two seasons. I don’t really care what they get for him. It will be addition by subtraction.
Zucc is a top 6 you need to get good return
If they get good return, great, but regardless of the return he needs to go.
If we do not hear about some major surgery to McD after the season, he has truly regressed.
Zucc is top 6 in this lineup, when NYR was contending he was a 3rd liner or played in the AV top 9 system, whatever that is.
I think he had a broken hand … and perhaps other issues. But his decision-making has dropped off.
I also don’t think you trade Topo for good riddance. They are sorely lacking in top-six wingers. if the return isn’t good, you keep him. If the return is good, bye.
ilb and Carp, thanks as always for your rational commentary when all around you is ledge. As to last night, I’m fairly certain the Bolts have a better roster than the Rangers and was not surprised that they eventually took over and ran away. Spooner’s and Pavelec’s (and, yes, the refs’) tough nights didn’t help, but the outcome was hardly surprising. At least they didn’t lose the 1st period!
if not traded this summer, they can still get a nice return for zucc at next trade deadline.
The lottery position is firming up. The Rangers can realistically finish only between 7th and 10th, giving them from a 20.4% to 11.4% chance at a top-three and between 6.5% and 3.5% to get Dahlin. Most likely they’ll be picking from 7 to 10, unless they think anyone but Dahlin is worth moving up for.
What is good return on Zucc? I might be biased, but I also think I’m realistic. I think the high on Zucc is what they got for Grabner. What we should expect is a middling prospect and a mid round pick. They are not getting a Nash package for him.
Trade the cookies. Eat their contracts
Carp up until two games ago there were very few new “kids” playing that are likely to be part of the longterm plan. I’d say really just Pionk if we are being honest (again not talking about Lias or Chytil), so don’t think it was a big concern if he lost more than he won his first 15 or so games. Up until what 3 games ago we were still playing a 4th line of all journeymen vets, so were we worried about their feelings too?!
Still smh over the Rangers losing JT Miller. lol- didn’t want to pay him for a big contract?? That’s sound logic; draft him first, invest the time of your hockey program to develop the player; & then unload him at the ripe old age of 25. Good chance he’ll be in the league for the next 10 years; putting up good numbers; plus he has big game pedigree in his arsenal; look for him to score big time goals in the playoffs. Stevie Y’s nobody’s fool.
Except he was a fool giving Cally that contract and he hasn’t been able to assemble a solid group of defenseman until this trade deadline and still not an ideal group
So I have no medical background, but, have observed that players that have generalized back problems sometimes have prematurely shortened careers. Adam Graves, Kevin Klein and maybe now McD come to mind. Can lingering effects cause them to skate more erect and take away some of their explosiveness and mobility? Certainly hand eye coordination doesn’t drop off at 30. Does anyone with some knowledge have an opinion?
Miller is do to score in the playoffs. 1 goal in 40 games.
BRuins had 2 first line forwards and a mid round 1st playing top pair 18 months after his draft.
Procrastinating, just ran an average of 8 polls (Hockey Writers, ISS, NHL…) to see what the scouting consensus was on the upcoming draft, and here are the averages for the top ten (Rangers now in the 10 hole):
Dahlin 1.0
Svechnikov 2.5
Zadina 3.5
Tkachuk 3.5
Boqvist 6.0
Wahlstrom 7.0
Bouchard 7.3
Hughes 7.4
Dobson 9.3
Pretty clear top 4. Significant dropoff from Hughes to Dobson and even more to the 11 spot, Hayten. I’m sure the list will change by June, but for now not that much worth tanking for. Maybe you trade to get the #4; otherwise it’s what your scouts think of the rest of them.
I find it difficult to believe that JT Miller has yet to do anything dumb so far in Tampa. Perhaps he has just been put in a position to succeed. The Rangers do not have anyone as good as the 2 linemates he is playing with, so there’s that. Still, it does not appear likely that Namestnikov will stick around and it once again looks like the Rangers were fleeced by Yzerman. There is also the play of McDonagh……..which has not been anywhere near his former excellence in the 5 or so Tampa games I have seen since he went there. Carp called the McDonagh deal a year ago so even then, the Rangers were concerned about the value of a big investment in him. Girardi seems to be productive in Tampa which could be systems related, or simply that the Tampa forwards play much closer to 200 feet than the Rangers forwards do.
Not sold on Tampa,,,,if they do not hold that division lead they may be out after first round
Speaking of McDonagh and Girardi. Hedman and Strallman matched up against the Rangers number one line (Zibanijad line). McDonagh and Girardi got the 2nd and 3rd line assignment.
Rangers had the last change BDL
not Tampa
So you only listed 9 players Norm, but don’t see how you come to the conclusion that we wouldn’t be better off drafting top 6. The two wingers after Dahlin are good goal scorers and are said to be NHL ready or close. And wahlstrom and tkachuk could be pretty good players in a couple seasons two (I’d lean towards wahlstrom as Tkachuk has yet to put up goals really the last couple levels he has been in). All that is to say we’d be much better off drafting higher
I’m well aware Alex.
Oops! Thanks for noting that, Pete. It’s Hayton at 10 (avg. 12.0 in polls) and then Lundestrom in 11th (at 12.8). And of course the Rangers would be better in the top 6, but they can’t get there without trading. They were never going to be able to tank to the 4-hole, much less the top3, in the wildest dreams of fans who would have preferred they try to lose. Realistically, they’re now looking at any one of: Bouchard/Hughes/Dobson/Hayton, if their scouts happen to be in line with the writers.
I don’t even know what to say sometimes.
Fraud Panthers.
LMAO:
Credit to the Bruins–they were a pretty meh-looking crew early on and now look like legit contenders. Nice job by mgmt. Dammit.
Good thing, Carp, that when you don’t know what to say, you do know how to write.
That is a Fraudulent Fondue Fork!
If you are rooting for Tampa to win the cup ( I’m not), this would be the year to root for them. The wheels are going to fall off next year, and that would make next years pick a good one.
BDL
i don’t think the wheels fall off for Tampa. They’re well positioned in my view. They can also buyout Coburn or Cally or both.
And for the record I wish them much success and it will improve a 2nd rd pick for us to a 1st.
My preferred cup teams are
Tampa
Toronto
Winnipeg
Hanks jock strap should always get the extra effort award. Apparently that thing does all the heavy lifting every game! 😉
Eh they were right on pace for around 4-5th before the trip to westerner Canada where they won three straight games. But 7th is best we could do now, tho not even hopeful for that
I agree with John m perez. How you trade someone you drafted @ 15 who has scored 50+ points in each of the last 3 seasons, who is a strong skilled physical player, who is also 24 years old.
Telling me the rangers we’re in no rush to trade zucc but JT had to go at the deadline bc of a long term contract extension they could have put off for a year with arbitration. It’s not like they got much value for him now,I would like to think Gorton could landed the picks and prospects for mcdonagh alone. Which makes it miller for Namestnikov. I don’t understand it unless J.T. made a big public stink about the sell off and JG saw it as cancerous going forward. Still jumped the shark on that one. Should have been a draft summer trade. Bad move
Rather than building expensive giant metal walls all over the NHL in order to keep Torts on his own side and then trying to make Musky pay for them, cheaper to hire McGrattan to shadow Torts around the Nation.
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